The fact that the hit is "debatable" makes the rule unclear, not to mention ridiculous.

Let 'em play football.

I give up trying to figure out what's legal and not anymore and what the NFL's punishment will be, if there is one at all. I know this: Since it's James Harrision that administered the blow, there will be a fine and a big one. I also know that whatever fine he does get will be larger than the one R. Lewis got for going helmet to helmet with Hines Ward and knocking him from the game. This much I know for sure. Everything else is totally up in the air.



The Steelers Pity Party has begun. -- Bob Smizik

Illegal hits in the NFL are like pornography, you can't really define it but you kind of know it when you see it. Trouble is that some porn may be art, and some art is pornography. Clearly the players, the coaches and the league all have a different interpretation of some of these "hits". McCoy was out of the pocket and was making a "football move" as a runner when Harrison came up him. It was bang, bang.
The NFL will probably fine him, but it's his only offense this season.
The comments by Mr Hemsley look to me to be a bit of grandstanding

Clearly, McCoy didn't have the ball when Harrison slammed his helmet into Colt's helmet. With his size advantage, why didn't Harrison simply tackle him? To me, this looks like nothing but an attempt to injure another player and to be Mr. Macho which, all too often, has become the norm in the NFL. Let's bring back the importance of tackling instead of hitting.

I must disagree with Harrison as to the timing of the hit, from where I sat it was definitely a late hit, quarterback or not, I think it deserved a penalty, and probably a fine and, or suspension.

If that hit had been on Big Ben the fans would have gone nuts. It's not hard to understand how Harrison could regress into that hit, he has certainly cleaned up his act since the new rules, and after having the fines levied against him, but old habits are hard to break, and in this case it was just a flashback to the past.

I also saw Harrison both use and extend his arms in that hit... which tells me the helmet was intentional but inadvertent. It seemed to me he tried more to knock him off his feet and the helmet of a more stout, crouching Harrison caught McCoy... he could have wrapped him up and driven him in to the frozen tundra - like that better?

As long as he doesn't get suspended, I don't get if he gets fined $10 or $1,000,000. It's not my money.

If that hit had been on Big Ben the fans would have gone nuts.

ding ding dinggggggg. That's why it's best not to complain about either the hits, the flags, the non-calls, any of it. Just watch the game and let the game unfold as it will. It doesn't make any difference to whine about it and often times fans are extreme hypocrites when it comes to this subject.

Tunch was claiming the Rule 12 quarterback as a runner on the radio broadcast almost immediately. Looking at the replays afterwards, even knowing what happened, it sure looked like McCoy was running the ball. The flip/pass came at the last second before the hit and Harrison was already "launched" before the flip pass. It was bang-bang. It definitely was helmet to helmet, but he looked like a runner, to me, when Harrison committed to the hit.

The Steelers Pity Party has begun. -- Bob Smizik

Bob, is this case, I believe the fact that McCoy actually tucked the ball as a runner should carry some weight. But even more important .. what was Harrison supposed to do ... lean his head back when he hit him? He didn't have time to adjust when McCoy decided to flick the ball out.

One final thing .. if you look at the replay, you will see that the Umpire was only a few yards away from the play and had a perfect view, and did NOT throw the flag .. in fact, he had a much better view than the referee did .. much better!!



What's he supposed to do? Are you kidding? Is slamming your helmet into the helmet of another player the only way to make a tackle? -- Bob Smizik

The hypocrisy, which is the NFL, is in reality only concerned with appearances. The NFL is cracking down only on the highly visible plays. I'd like to see a breakdown of head trauma by position. I'll bet the highest percentage is not quarterbacks. It stands to reason that you want to protect your product, and the game suffers without your first string quarterback. I don't have any problem with the Harrison hit, because it wasn't malicious or nearly as hard as he could have hit him. Until the NFL really backs up the rhetoric about protecting its players from head shots by making a running back lowering their head an illegal play or eliminating down linemen, I'll take it for what it is, PR and deferred liability for the future of the game. Late hits, hits when a guy is down or out of bounds, hits to the knees, those are dirty. James Farrior played a dirtier game last night than Harrison.


There are special rules for the QB, and understandably so. They often are defenseless. -- Bob Smizik

Let the whining about helmet to helmet injuries continue. If the league and YOU all are so concerned, then why not make a fuss about hits to the head of a RB

I think from now on, Harrison should stop sprinting to the ball and ask the QB if he is going to pass or run. That way, there can be no ambiguity. The quartergback can play at full speed and run for first downs all night, but the defense really shouldn't stop him. I mean, whatever, he hit him helmet to helmet so fine him all you want. But when you are running full speed chasing someone, it's not that easy to stop a 250 LB body, especially when the QB is capable of running for a first down.

@ Dan

Regarding Big Ben; there is a major difference between when he gets hit helmet to helmet or low in the pocket vs when he is running the ball.

In this very same game, Mendy took a helmet to helmet shot that wasn't called because he is a RB. That was no big deal.

I also didn't see ESPN, Yahoo, USA Today, and PFT all over the Ray Lewis helmet to helmet hit on Hines Ward.

Just tackle him normally and no foul occurs. Defenders want the splash play. Sorry Harrison......you were wrong.

Foo



Exactly! -- Bob Smizik

Pity party or not, the guy was right on.

I think Harrison will be heavily fined for the hit. And I think he should. A bigger concern for me is that Colt McCoy said in an interview that he "doesn't remember" the hit...but somehow he was allowed back on the field 2 plays later. What about the NFL's so called rules on making sure players pass the tests on whether they have concussion like symptoms? Especially considering the backup QB threw a nice pass to get the Browns to the 5yd line, there is no reason McCoy should've come back in that game. It may have been the reason they lost.

Let's justify the rule of thuggery! The hit was typical thug football.

A fine is meaningless. Suspend him four games.

This ongoing discussion about Wallace is framed with the idea that because of their salary cap situation the Steelers will not be able to afford to sign him. I would ask the question like this: If the Steelers had plenty of cap room should they sign him to a hugh contract?
My answer would be "no". I think he is good but not great. He has average hands, average ability to get open, average running ability after making the catch, and below average blocking skills. He has fantastic speed but never seems to make big plays in big games.
I would prefer that the Steelers keep Wallace but not for a huge price.



Back-to-back 1,000-yard seasons are not `average.

The rules sound subjective so the punishment/no punishment decision will reflect that. In other words they can present agruments either way to support what ever decision is made.

I question the level of embelishment Mc Coy added to the situation? Earlier in the game following a brush by Farrior he flopped to the ground drawing a late hit penalty.

If McCoy suffered a concussion, or if it was suspected he had one, why did the Browns allow him back in the game?

Should the Browns face some punishment for allowing a potentially concussed player to return to the game?


It's possible the Brown were wrong and will be punished for allowing McCoy back in the game. That's another matter.
You question his embellishment after a hit like that? Pretty funny. --- Bob Smizik

@Earl,

you raise a good point about McCoy's return. After the KC game, Florio was rounding up the pitchforks and torches to come after Tomlinstein.

fine yes...suspension no...it is football afterall...

As long as he doesn't get suspended, I don't get if he gets fined $10 or $1,000,000. It's not my money.

A -4 for this comment? Anyone of you 4 care to explain why you DO care so much about James Harrison's money?

The headline in the ESPN blog about summed it up. James Harrison just isn't learning. And I don't know what can be done to change that. Obviously fines aren't working. I suppose the league could try suspensions with the attendant loss of income, but I don't know if anything would really change him...

Dirty late hit. Again.

What we've learned: this team doesn't play well (on offense) in the cold weather. First Kansas City, now Cleveland. They've now turned the ball over three times when they were heading for a score. And this is against inferior opponents.

At least the first playoff game will likely be at a warm weather site (Oakland, Houston) unless you believe in Tebow-mania. But after that, if they even get by the first round, it'll be at New England or Baltimore. So long terms prospects at a Super Bowl run don't look good.

Whether Harrison's hit was "legal" or not, he got penalized on the play. And since he's a repeat offender, he's going to get a hefty fine (at best) or suspension (at worst). Since the 49ers game is a national TV game, it's possible they'll just give him a hefty fine instead of a suspension. If the next game was against St. Louis instead of SF, it might've very well been a suspension (if it's not this time around).

*t's possible the Brown were wrong and will be punished for allowing McCoy back in the game. That's another matter.
You question his embellishment after a hit like that? Pretty funny. --- Bob Smizik


Glad you found it as intented.

Perhaps the Steelers should trade Harrison to save their brand?

As far as I was concerned, McCoy was holding up a sign that said "Please Hit Me" and Harrison did. I don't have a problem with it. McCoy could have slid, he didn't.

It was a crucial part of the game where the Steelers were trying to stop a drive.

@Bingram,

Why is Harrison the only player in the league who "isn't learning"? He isn't the only guy with a helmet to helmet hit in his career but the only one who gets ostrocized for this. Like I said before, Ray Lewis decapitated Ward with a much more blatant and vicious helmet to helmet shot that was easily avoidable. There wasn't a peep out of anybody regarding that because for whatever reason Ray Lewis has some kind of light around him.


I saw Brandon Spikes from the Patriots hit a Giants WR or TE helmet to helmet from behind when he wa defenseless. No call or complaints there. But Harrison is the only player who isn't learning?

If this were a play in the pocket and Harrison came rolling through and hit McCoy high and late, I'd feel differently. McCoy is a capable runner and proved that earlier. He had the ball tucked and was running like he was going for a first down, then pulled up and threw nearly aking to an option play.

It was permissible for Mendy to sustain a helmet to helmet hit, which was lauded by the way, because he is a RB. Next time he is running the ball and he doesn't have a lane, should he just pull up and throw it away so nobody can hit him?

Harrison should be fined. But the guy who clubbed Ben in the head in the first half better be fined as well.

...
McCoy definitely MIGHT have suffered a concussion.

Doesn't the NFL have rules requiring some testing on the sidelines?

If the NFL is serious about preventing long term concussion damage, they need to show the public they care about sending players back into the game, when they are most vulnerable to further damage.

There are possibly some rationalizations for Harrison's play, instant decision, QB was now a running back, plays at lightning speed, yahda, yahda, yahda.

There is no rationalization why McCoy was allowed to re-enter the game. They have coaches, medics, probably doctors, on the sidelines. Minutes, not split seconds to make a decision.

There is no wiggle room for any rationalization.



I understand the NFL has already called the Browns owner to New York. It all starts at the top. -- Bob Smizik

@BFD

You are right. So I will complain about helmet to helmet hits on running backs. I see no reason why helmet to helmet hits on running backs are legal. Are the brains of running backs somehow different? Are they in less danger because they are running the ball from a handoff rather than a hike?

I thought pads were supposed to protect players, not be used as weapons. When protective gear (helmets and shoulder pads) are used as weapons and not as protection they should be re-designed. My crazy idea is that to drastically decrease head injuries the NFL should go back to leather helmets and shoulder pads (or designed in other ways to be for protection, not sadism).


QBs are usually defenseless. RBs are usually not. That's the difference. For decades defenseless kickers were protected. The NFL finally has started to protect defense QBs. Makes sense to me. -- Bob Smizik

I think Harrison is going to see a fine...

He lowered his head...
If it was facemask to facemask kind of hit... no problem, but it wasn't.

I disagree that QB's are totally defenseless. They are allowed to throw away the ball outside the pocket, they can slide on a running play, and you can't hit them high or low. Even pass blocking rules were changed to protect them.

McCoy looked like he was running on the play last night but Harrison could have used better technique. Especially after watching Farrior get called for "hitting" a ballcarrier out of bounce. I've seen far worst than that not called.

There are some QB's who will use these rules to their advantage like sliding at the last minute. It is going to be interesting to see how the officials handle QB's like Tebow. You don't know if he'll run, pitch it, or throw.

Or you can always put dresses on them


OK, they're not totally defenseless. But they're usually defenseless. McCoy was defenseless on that play. If that play happened to Ben, I think the general thinking would be a bit different. -- Bob Smizik

The hit was not within the rules. McCoy was escaping the pocket and not trying to advance the ball. It was clear he was looking at his receiver all the way.

Harrison needs to use more sense.

This ongoing discussion about Wallace is framed with the idea that because of their salary cap situation the Steelers will not be able to afford to sign him. I would ask the question like this: If the Steelers had plenty of cap room should they sign him to a hugh contract?
My answer would be "no". I think he is good but not great. He has average hands, average ability to get open, average running ability after making the catch, and below average blocking skills. He has fantastic speed but never seems to make big plays in big games.
I would prefer that the Steelers keep Wallace but not for a huge price.



Back-to-back 1,000-yard seasons are not `average.

Try watching the hit at game speed. In slow motion a lot of hits are going to look flagrant. Like Jack Lambert and the 73 year old guy who blogged earlier said. They should wear skirts and most of you must be girls and don't like football. What I want to know is where are all the flags when Ben gets nailed game after game and James gets held game after game? This is football, girls,it's the way men have been coached to play since they were young boys. It's total BS if James get suspended for this. He hasn't been fined all year.

Everyone is always taking low shots on Ben's knees.
Yes Ben was out of the pocket when he got hurt so no penalty was needed when Ben got hurt.
However, from an ethical stand point the Browns player could have wrapped Ben up around the waist and slung him to the ground.

By the same token McCoy was out of the pocket and clearly going to run with the ball until he saw Harrison coming at him and then he chickened out and tried to sling it.
He had a chance to duck and he didn't.
He chose to stand there and throw it.

IMO both the one on Ben and the one on McCoy were legal but yet unethical hits.

They hurt our boy we hurt there's

Before anyone cause me a jerk, Even Tunch on the radio call said when Harrison hit a Brown out of bounds late but not all that hard that if your going to take 15 yds anyways you may as well make it worth it and really pop hit him hard.

Good point above. How about Ben getting clubbed in the head???? Huh do-gooders?

Harrison is a very stupid man. I hope he gets fined $100,000. Maybe he will change his style of play and not end up getting suspended when the Steelers need him.

I thought there was absolutely nothing wrong with the hit last night. It was two players moving full speed towards each other and one player (McCoy)
making a last minute decision to pass the ball which opened him up to getting crushed by Harrison. Hopefully the NFL will see things differently than instances where it's a flagrant, blatant attempt to injure someone, of course we'd have to go back to the days when Pete Rozelle was commissioner and you could actually play football but you get my point.

I would like to see a reverse angle of this play, too. I am not denying there was helmet to helmet contact. But it kind of looked like Harrison did use his hands first and came up and through with his helmet.

The angles I have seen don't give a clear picture of that, though.

Helmet to helmet isn't allowed anywhere on the field. Ryan Clark got $40k fine for his and that was with heads moving all around. Harrison went directly with his helmet into McCoy's helmet. A fine is definitely coming and should come.

Xmas,

The camera angles were HORRIBLE all night last night. The NFL network is worse than Versus as far as production quality goes. And trust me on this, I know what I'm talking about here.

@bdubb,

I don't think that is true. I think that ball carriers who aren't considerend defenseless can be hit helmet to helmet.

If you play for the Steelers, doesn't matter if you are defenseless or not, you can be hit helmet to helmet. And there will be no penalty or nationwide hysteria.

A helmet to helmet is allowed for tackling a RB ... as per 2 goalline tackles on Mendenhall last night. Someone running with the ball is not considered as defenseless

I so love states of defenselessness. Even if the NFL refs were young enough to keep up with the game, how can anyone determine all of this BS in a split second ?
Insanity !!!

I fully expect the NFL to address this issue by no longer allowing the QB to run the ball, since it directly conflicts with their current rule.

Why fix the rule when you can circumvent it in order to avoid future lawsuits?

I know this guy is not a big Pgh fan favorite but listen to what Warren sapp said this week on inside the NFL about tackling and how difficult it is to remove the head from the equation. It makes perfect sense. These plays need to looked at independantly. The NFL loves to put a blanket on everythingand classify every incident the same which in cases like Harrison's hit I don't think you can. Goodall is ruining the NFL in my opinion and I'm sure that there will be a huge fine for 92 coming. Just seems wrong given the instances which this play occurred.

How hard is it to just not lead with your helmet when you tackle?
If its too hard for Harrison then maybe it's time we found another linebacker to replace him. It isnt like we don't have a dozen of them always coming through the pipeline.
The second I saw the play I knew a fine was coming and probably should be a suspension. This is like his fifth or sixth offense of this type. How else is be going to learn, are the steelers going to learn, that this can't be tolerated?

The only proposed rule that ever made any sense was Jack Lambert's ... just make the QB put on dresses

I think it is LeBeau's fault. If he didn't call the defense that allowed the QB to escape toward the line of scrimmage and act like a runner and then throw a pass Harrison would not have been in position to make a potentially illegal hit.

Once again the coaches fault, when will you guys ever learn.

when you tackle, the head automatically is ahead of the rest of your body........ hence that fatboy SAPS point.

I am all for hard hits, but Harrison knows the rules by now. That hit was unnecessary and dangerous. He almost seemed to lower his helmet in an attempt to 'spear' McCoy. James should know better.

And to mention "spearing"... Did anyone happen to catch Ovechkin "spearing" Neil of the Senators last night? And the referee gave Neil a diving penalty? Talk about a double standard. It is just a matter of time when Ovechkin pulls this garbage on the wrong guy, and pays a dear price for his cheap shots. If the league won't do anything about his stick work and the fact that he leaves his feet on every singe check, the players will.

Harrison should have learned not to lead with his helmet after last year...but they league has been very inconsistent. This season an offensive player hit Harrison in the head and fracture his eye socket. No penalty, no fine, no suspension. The Texans were talking up how much tougher they were than the Steelers, breaking Harrison's skull and sending Roethlisberger away in a walking boot.

Another inconsistency is that the Browns team also needs to be sanctioned for yesterday's incident. I keep hearing that the league has very very strict rules for players who have suffered (or may have suffered) a concussion. Polamalu for instance was taken out of the Kansas City game. The Browns never should have let McCoy back in the game. McCoy shouldn't be fined or suspended because we can assume that he wasn't cognitively able to determine his fitness to return. His team should have been looking out for his safety and kept him out of the game.

The full article at the link brought up the interesting point of quarterbacks trying to bait defenders into illegal hits. That is possible. Another possibility worth considering is how many defenders are injured trying to avoid hitting a quarterback late. I think that a charging 300 lb guy can't stop quickly or turn quickly without potential injury to ankles, knees, etc.

Finally, Thursday evening games are not a great idea. Teams need more time to prepare and recover if they've just played on Sunday. Thursday evening games have been around for a while, but they were much more rare. I would still keep them occasionally--especially for the season opener and definitely the two Thanksgiving games. But I see no reason to play every Thursday evening from late October through the end of the regular season.

McCoy has taken a beating this season. When the Browns played the Texans his mom was at the game (he's from Texas) and former President George H W Bush was an honorary captain. His mom especially was really worried to see him getting clobbered by the Texans defense. Roethlisberger is getting all the attention today but McCoy is pretty tough himself.

The ESPN blogger, Jamison Hensley, who wrote that James just "Isn't Learning" really took th lazy way out with that one. Based on the manner in which Harrison has been hitting quarterbacks lately, I was expecting to see an article soon using him as an example of how someone can change their game and still be successful, and I have commented such on this blog. However, all of those noticably clean hits went completely unnoticed, of course, by writers who need Harrison as a villian, and after this one "relapse" the grand statement is made that Harrison has learned nothing. Well, from someone who has obviously been payin closer attention, that is just not true, and I'm feeling strangely compelled to defend him.

Ahhh. the "defenseless player" card. Why is it that a 250 lb TE can be clobbered and nothing thrown yet a puny WR takes the same exact hit and flags fly? aREN'T they both "defenseless"

These rules are not being consistantly called/enforced.

***** NOTICE TO ALL DEFENSIVE PERSONAL****

going forward please allow the player with the ball to completely catch and control the ball, then gingerly take them to the ground.


Sincerely,
Roger Goodell

written by danch70, December 09, 2011 - 10:36 AM

@BFD

You are right. So I will complain about helmet to helmet hits on running backs. I see no reason why helmet to helmet hits on running backs are legal. Are the brains of running backs somehow different? Are they in less danger because they are running the ball from a handoff rather than a hike?

why don't running backs who lower their heads while running get flagged/fined? just as guilty IMHO.

Unless I'm wrong, this is Harrison's 9th game this year (he missed four with his orbital bone injury). He wasn't fined in his first 8 games. So he clearly has tried to play within the rules.

Yes, Harrison will and likely should be fined for his hit on McCoy but anyone who knows football would acknowledge that it looked like McCoy was about to run...he had run out of the pocket and was very close to the line of scrimmage.

I say this with respect, but your comments Bob seem to indicate a personal grudge against Harrison. Maybe he deserves it for his behavior over the years, but you seem to be focusing entirely on Harrison's action and not McCoy's. Players launch their helmets at runners on virtually every running play and this for all intents looked like one until the last moment.


Which comments of mine are you talking about? -- Bob Smizik

Like it or not, James Harrison has a rep and will therefore be subject to this type of criticism. Accept it and move on. And please let's stop acting like the league only screws up calls involving the Steelers. We're just more inclined to notice those screw-ups.

I agree with BFD's comments on this thread....

The NFL is the one going craszy over this helmet to helmet hit issue....but the biggest issue is their inconsistency. As BFD asks above....if the NFL is so concerned about helmet to helmet hits and injuries they cause....then why are they permissible on running backs??? The helmet to helmet hit the Browns' Golong made on Mendenhall was just a great hit....allbeit helmet to helmet....but helmet to helmet hits on RB's are ok....I guess running backs aren't subject to concussions.

Mike Golic on his show today was reading something from an NFL rulebook on his show that said you can't hit a defenseless player....QB or any player...who is attempting or has attempted to throw a pass...and he said that rule probably takes away Harrison's argument about McCoy being out of the pocket and becoming a running back.

The point is this.....how in the world can the NFL or anyone expect these players....playing a game in milliseconds....to ejudicate every hit before they make them??? It's ludicrous.

I expect Harrison not only to be fined hevily but also suspended at least one game. He's already been judged in the court of public opinion...especially outside pof Pittsburgh and in the NFL offices. And not just whining or having a Steelers Pity Party Bob but I believe Roger the Dodger is just waiting for an opportunity to give Mr. Harrison his own version of a concussion.

Oh, also... I totally agree with those calling out Florio, ESPN and the like for their silence about the Browns' handling of Colt McCoy last night. Where's all their righteous indignation today? Hypocrites.

Bob,

Looked like Mend was hit the same way close to the goal line but there was no pentalty on that. Please explain the difference?

What Harrison says makes sense. The QB was out of the pocket and tucked the ball to run. At that point he's considered a RB. If his hit on QB was illegal then many other hits on RB should also get flags.

Anyone of you 4 care to explain why you DO care so much about James Harrison's money?

I don't think people do care about his money, but you seem to want to point the conversation there.

Reads to me that people are responding to Bob's post debating whether or not the hit was illegal per league rules.

I wonder just how much the media frenzy over the hit will contribute to Harrison's punishment.

I think without all the stories about it, it's likely just a fine. But it's now received significant attention, so I could see the league issuing a suspension to go along with a fine, to prove they are serious about player safety.

for all of those saying Harrison is wrong here and deserves a fine and /or suspension:

I am sure all of you will also be going after Lewis, Ngata, and the other defenders from other teams who have hit Steelers helmet-to-helmet and have not been fined/suspended. Right?

I also remember the game last year at NO where Ward was hit in the helmet and no flag. Thats ok, right??

Hypocrites one and all.

I am not suggesting 2 wrongs make a right, or that Harrison was in the right, but CONSISTENCY is the key to good rule enforcement. Whether it be in the NFL, or on the "kinder, gentler" blog.

CONSISTENCY!!!!!!!!

The Browns find themselves in an interesting predicament, if they say McCoy was seriously injured on the play then they face certain repercussions from the league for putting him back in the game, if they say sideline tests revealed no concussion then they admitt that the hit most likely was not as bad as it appeared.

If Bob's info about the Cleveland ownership being summoned to the league office is correct then their response in this line of questioning could play a part in any fine or suspension to Harrison.



That was a failed attempt at humor. -- Bob Smizik

There are very few things that I dislike more than a double standard.

Ray Lewis lays a vicious helmet to helmet hit on Hines, no flag is thrown, he gets a miniscule 20K fine, and there is no public outrage let alone calls for a suspension. Last year, Heath gets decapitated by McClain and nothing happens. No flag or fine.

There must be dozens of examples like this. The playing field regarding flags and fines is definitely not leveled.

This is Harrison's first (likely) fine of the season and we are in Week 14. A suspension would be idiotic as McCoy looked for all intents and purposed to be a runner, and he came back on the field one or two plays later.

As juvenile and disrespectful as Harrison's comments about Goodell were earlier this season, one has to believe that the Commissioner of a league won't engage in vendetta justice.

...one has to believe that the Commissioner of a league won't engage in vendetta justice.

Haha... funny man.

@Roger Roger

RIGHT ON! I am glad Im not the only one who remembers that hit in New Orleans. There was also the hit fron Chung on SNF.

The Steelers are the only team I watch consistently. But it seems that anytime one of our players makes a borderline hit, it's flagged. But when the opposition drops a blatantly illegal shot on us, there is no call. And that hasn't just happened once or twice or three or four or 5 times. It has occurred many times since the "crackdown" stemming from the Harrison Witch Hunt 2010.

All of those instances are what I base my opinion on and at some point, it goes beyond human error and inconsistency and delineates towards agendas and message sending.


I believe the key phrase above is ``The Steelers are the only team I watch consistently.''

Do you seriously believe the NFL is out to get the Steelers? If so, what is its motive? -- Bob Smizik

Let me get this straight...An NFL game is on the line, and a fleet footed QB is running out of the pocket and towards open field.
A LB races over and makes a solid hit on him.....And this is a problem?
Let's face it....Just a few short years ago, this would've been nothing more than fodder for NFL films.
But....Enter Roger Goodell AKA the surliest man in sports....And it's considered one step lower than murder.
James Harrison did what he's paid to do.....Stop an opposing player.
I'm not interested in all this crap about helmet to helmet.
If you stand on the sideline of a Pee Wee league football game, you'll hear helmets colliding on every play.
There's one solution to avoiding hits like this.....Don't play football.

I posed this on a message board and will post it here again:

"The NFL's double standard on hard hits has successfully "trickled down" to the masses. Unbelievable."

Bob, you simply refuse to get the point that McCoy was RUNNING with the ball. Not scrambling, not juking a rusher in the pocket, but RUNNING, ball tucked in and clearly running to the outside to gain yardage. He suddenly pulled up short and threw. I think I know why. He saw Harrison coming at him.

You and I can stop typing in a nanosecond. Harrison is running toward the RUNNER and can`t stop in a nanosecond.

Meanwhile, the stinking trolls are swarming today.

That Roger Goodell must be losing a ton of sleep.

With all these attempts he is making to keep the Steelers down, they are still 10-3. " Those pesky player rising above my, partial to the Steelers rules and fines. Damn them!"

C'mon people. It makes no sense. There is no witch hunt.

@Nutting, I don't think anybody said Harrison is the only guy not learning. The ESPN blogs said, and I agree, that he is not learning.

He's is certainly not the only one....

Jim Harrison is and always was the leagues biggest cheap-shot artist. That's how he made his rep, hitting defenseless receivers & QB's. A real tough guy.

Actually Bob, I wish Ben would use more of this rules to protect himself. He was outside the pocket on the play he suffered the injury. The way was holding onto the ball I assume nobody was open. Take the incompletion

Although Blogger Bob has suddenly gone silent, lets not forget that his reply to the MANY inconsistencies with the doling our of penalties, fines and suspensions is that the ref's are human. " It is human nature." I will be sure to use this next time my company is fined millions of dollars for not adhering to federal laws.


And again. To whoever asked why people are concerned with fines. I don't care about Harrisons bank account. I do care that this form of 1 man justice (Goodell) is changing the way the game is played and potential results.

I loved the hit!!

Nothing better than seeing a little brownie out cold on the Heinz field turf.

. I do care that this form of 1 man justice (Goodell) is changing the way the game is played and potential results.
-------------------------
Balogna

I glad James Harrison isn't learning from the idiot sports media who are doing nothing more than trying to ruin the game of football.

If you can't handle the heat then get out of the kitchen.

The refs may be human, but most are far too old to be involved in a game of such speed and physicality. The NFL needs full-time refs and there needs to be an age limit. These guys just can't keep up.

I believe the key phrase above is ``The Steelers are the only team I watch consistently.''

Do you seriously believe the NFL is out to get the Steelers? If so, what is its motive? -- Bob Smizik

The first part I posted as a basis to support the plays I have seen in Steelers games where we get called for borderline "Safety" precaution plays while our opponents are not flagged for BLATANTLY crossing that line.

To answer the second part: Out to get the Steelers from a W/L stand point? no, and thats because it is too hard to prove. Trying to get the Steelers away from ultra-physical football and change the paradigm of the game to be more cohesive with Goodell's vision? yes. This does not mean I don't have any regard for player safety, my point is that Steelers play physical and get flags while opponents do same and/or worse and get none

I think that the inconsistency in enforcing the safety rules in games concerning the Steelers goes beyond human error. I just don't see how :
- The NO hit on Ward was missed
- The Lewis hit on Ward was missed
- The Chung hit on Ward was missed
- The Ravens hit on Antonio Brown was missed
- The McClain hit on Miller was missed
- The NUMEROUS hits to Ben's head and knees are missed.

There are many more Bob, I could go on all day.

I am sorry, but then those fouls occurred, the officials HAD to be watching because that is where the action was taking place. There was a bog to-do made about player safety and to ignore ALL of those penalties is a bit unnerving. It is impossible that human error is the reason for ALL of those being missed.



Perhaps you can explain why the Steelers are 12th in penalties and 10th in yards penalized -- and that's with having played one more game than 30 of the other teams. The facts do not mesh with your Steelers pity party. --- Bob Smizik

Well said Nutting4xmas.....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c...xid=cnnbin

Well, I guess I`m not the only one who thinks McCoy was a runner on that play. Thank you, Mr. Cain.

Perhaps you can explain why the Steelers are 12th in penalties and 10th in yards penalized -- and that's with having played one more game than 30 of the other teams. The facts do not mesh with your Steelers pity party. --- Bob Smizik
=========
Bob - Scissor up that tired argument.
Strategic refball is where it's at.
It's not "how many penalties" are called....It's "when" they're called and "how" it affects the game.
Only an 8 year old would fall for that argument you continue to push.

Perhaps you can explain why the Steelers are 12th in penalties and 10th in yards penalized -- and that's with having played one more game than 30 of the other teams. The facts do not mesh with you Steelers pity party. --- Bob Smizik

I looked at the penalty stats and the real comparison that bugs me is this: The Ravens position on that list. They play the same schedule as we do and a VERY similar style. However, their opponents average an addition 20 penalty yards per game and the Ravens, of all teams, are one of the least penalized themselves.

Also, I don't see how general stats prove my point about specific calls and non-calls and uneven enforcement.

I would like to specify that we are 10th and 12th in those categories as in 10th and 12th MOST penalized and not 10th and 12th least penalized.

If you view the least amout of penalties and penalty yards as the best, we are 19th in yards and 16th in penalties.



You're a tough man to convince. Let me ask you this: If the Steelers are being targeted, what's happening to all the teams with more penalties and more penalty yards? Are they also being targeted? -- Bob Smizik

Bob,

Re: what comments was I referring to, the first comment that surprised me was about the 'Steelers' Pity Party has begun'.

I don't disagree that Steelers' fans whine a LOT and all teams are fined. But the stats do show that the Steelers' fines as a team are disproportionately high compared to the rest of the league.

The comment that most surprised me was:

"What's he supposed to do? Are you kidding? Is slamming your helmet into the helmet of another player the only way to make a tackle?"

The writer had pointed out that McCoy was running until the last second and you don't seem to be taking that into account vis a vis a possible fine. I find it refreshing that you are not a homer and I agree with you players should not lead with the helmet; but I felt (and feel) that there are extenuating circumstances on the Harrison hit.

Technically, the 'quarterbacks should be protected' axiom should result in a suspension to Scott Paxon - he dove at Ben's lower legs. But the league will say - quite rightly - that Ben was out of the pocket and technically a runner. The same holds true for McCoy, at least from my vantage point.

I do respect that you feel otherwise.

Well Said Daquido.

Bob - How do you know the Steelers shouldn't be tops in penalties called against them (meaning the least penalized?), thus making 12th a huge disgrace?

Going by rank as you continue to do regardless of posters debunking this is nonsense.

@BFD,

I just want to know how the Ravens are the 7th least penalized team and they're #1 in penalty yards against their opponent.

I am sorry, but that just does not add up.

[1]
You're a tough man to convince. Let me ask you this: If the Steelers are being targeted, what's happening to all the teams with more penalties and more penalty yards? Are they also being targeted? -- Bob Smizik [/1]

Bob,

you can't look at these figures in a vaccuum! My point was not that the aggregate number of penalties and penatly yards are noticeably disproportionate to favor a specific team but rather the nature and validity of the foul.

The #1 team in peanlties in the NFL might have the least amount of penalty yards if they commit 8 penalties a game, but they are all procedure fouls.

There are MANY other factors and showing me numbers doesn't answer my question regarding those specific examples of blatant non-calls against our opponents when we get called for FAR LESS. That is not something that can be quantified!

You are equally hard to convince because you totally ignore part of my argument.

After everything you have seen in the sporting landscape over the past few years, is it THAT hard to believe that there could be a league mandate to enforce the new safety rules mroe heavily against the Steelers than their opponent in order to send a message for not cooperating?

After all, the Steelers were the only team not to ratify the CBA right? They wanted an appeals process that was less unilateral and here we find out there is indeed an appeals process and the chief is Art Shell. There is NO WAY he would have anything against the Steelers.

After all of the things the Steelers have said in the media about Goodell and the rules, EVEN AJR II!!!!!!!!, I don't think it is a stretch that there is some message sending going on.



I do. -- Bob Smizik

I going to cut Harrison a huge break on this one. McCoy tucked the ball in like a running back and took off. Harrison was simply coming hard to stop the run. McCoy suddenly went from RB to QB and made a last second quick toss, LITERALLY. The time elapsed between the moment when McCoy first began to raise his arm to moment of impact was only 1/2 a second. I timed it myself a dozen times and on my stopwatch was it ranged between 0.53 and 0.56 seconds. So, Harrison only had 1/2 a second to stop his tackle, assuming he noticed the throwing attempt instantly. I'm sorry his helmet hit McCoy but that was inadvertant. And there was no way this was a late hit.

Xmas,

Another call like the ones your talking about happened in the Browns' first drive last night. I won't try to spell his name, but #11 obviously pushed Willie Gay off on a pass near the goal line and nothing was called. I believe even Mayock said it should have been a penalty.

I know these happen in every game, but if nothing else, it points to the inconsistency or incompetence of the NFL officials. Some conspiracy theorists might go as far as to bring money wagered on the game into it. Keep a lopsided game close. Maybe just to make the league seem more competitive.

As I said earlier, I think it's because the refs are too old to keep up. Add to that the confusion as to how to interpret King Roger's commandments, and it leads to at least turmoil.

My guess is that the league will take this opportunity to, yet again, clarify their muddy rules. To wit, they will clarify that a QB is NEVER a "runner" as long as he is still behind the line of scrimmage. That is, as long as the QB COULD still throw a pass, his head is protected from H-to-H blows.

In reality, of course, a defensive player can't be looking around trying to figure out where a QB running toward the line of scrimmage is, in relation to that line. He needs to assume the QB is going to keep coming and run the ball, and he needs to tackle that QB as a runner within the rules, which includes being able to go helmet to helmet.

They have not outlawed helmet to helmet hits, even on QBs, remember. Asking James Harrison to be "nice" and stop tackling runners helmet to helmet is asking him to do somehting the rules do not require. He can still smack runners in the head with his helemmet if he wants to.

The only VALID question here is,....When is a QB a runner, and so able to be hit in the head, H-to-H? My guess is the league will say, "Not until he crosses the line of scrimmage."

To clarify, they have not outlawed helmet to helmet hits, even on QBs, ALTOGETHER. When a QB is a runner, his head is still free game, under the rules, at least until they change them. I think Harrison had good reason to view McCoy as a runner here.

"With defensive secondaries increasingly emasculated by no-contact rules and pash-rushers slowed by a spate of dont-breathe-on-the-super star reforms named after pretty-boy franchise quaterbacks (the "Brady Rule," the "Carson Palmer rule"), the NFL has rapidly evolved into a kind of glorified Arena League, where a team's success or failure mostly depends on who it has throwing thw ball."

@RyanGraham,

Very, very well said.

Muddying up the already muddy waters is due ahead!

*t was astonishing to listen to Vinnie and Cook today. I assumed that these professionals who do nothing but sports would have at least an elementary knowledge of the NFL rulebook, but today I listened to several hours of shocking ignorance. Vinnie and Cook believe that ALL helmet to helmet contact has been outlawed by the NFL, including hits to the helmets of running backs. This led to many frustrating phone calls as they ignorantly argued with callers trying to make the point that perhaps McCoy had lost his protection as a QB when he tucked and ran. Their bizarre position then led to a flood of callers outraged over the lack of a personal foul on the Browns for the violent helmet hit on Mendenhall at the goal line. This led to strange arguements from Cook that the refs had a hard time seeing the hit on Mendenhall because he was in among all those bodies while the hit on McCoy was out in the open. They refused to listen to callers trying to tell them that helmet to helmet on a RB was within the rules. Unbelieveable!

"More and more, the NFL is taking on the character of the NBA, where no lead is safe and games almost always come down to the last possession. How much of this is by design is hard to say, but in watching the absurd passing and scoring numbers put up in the NFL this year (Drew Brees, Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers are all on pace to break the single-season passing record), it's hard not to imagine some backroom conspiracy of owners, marketing reps and TV-network executives deciding privately to juice the league's touchdown numbers in an attempt to corral that most loathsome creature in the entire sports biosphere, the "casual fan."

Bob - Scissor up that tired argument.
Strategic refball is where it's at.
It's not "how many penalties" are called....It's "when" they're called and "how" it affects the game.
Only an 8 year old would fall for that argument you continue to push.

Now we're REALLY tightening up that tinfoil hat too much.

Why would Art Shell have a grudge against the Steelers that results in calls being made against them, not too many in a game, but big ones at the right time, while similar actions the opponent take against them are ignored on purpose?

I would ask if anyone else sees how crazy this is, but You're in Homer Country.

Aero, Colin Dunlap was equally confused. The very fact that these people can spread their confusion about the rules on the radio only highlights how vague and wavering the rules truly are on this matter. Anyone claiming Harrision was clearly wrong here has an agenda that has nothing to do with playing WITHIN THE RULES.

*t is on national tv and is a hit to the chin with the top of the helmet.... What can a ref do?
The rule seems logical, cept the game is not. It is instant decisions based on a athletes instant reactions. What can he do, turn his head risk injury to himself? Arm tackle and let another 200 lb man rip his arm from the shoulder socket.... I am very confused how to call this great rule that is just so damn stupid at the same time....
David

One thing everyone should be able to agree on. Officiating is aweful!
They can even get replays right

Thugs like Harrison and Ryan Clark need to be shown films of guys like Jack Ham and Andy Russell on how to tackle. I never saw those guys leading with the helmet and I think you would agree they were pretty good.

I also read several posts claiming "this is how the game is played, get used to it." Au contraire, intentionally leading with the helmet is a relatively modern development. Even Ronnie Lott, known for savage hits, was usually able to avoid using his helmet to bring down ball carriers.

Even the Oakland Raiders of the 70's, with Chuck Noll's "criminal element," didn't use their helmets in such a way. Granted, they found other ways to injure players but the league addressed it just as they addressing the situation now.

I believe it was CSF who mentioned the violent helmet to helmet hits Mendenhall took at the goal line. Will the culprits be fined???? No way!

How about the offensive lineman who broke Harrison's orbital bone with a helmet to helmet hit? Was he fined?

Sure seems like selective justice if you ask me.

*t is absolutely RACIST and shows out of touch and antiquated social/athletic sensibilities to call Harrison and Clark "thugs", especially when comparing them to 2 older white Steelers.

If it's so obviously unnecessary and wrong to tackle head first, why hasn't the NFL outlawed it entirely, as so many mistakenly believe? Because football players have heads and tackle with their eyes, hence tackles require helmets leading the way. It's impossible to outlaw all helmet to helmet contact.

Finally, Hartison lead with his hands on the tackle. He shoved McCoy, kept going, head up, and their heads met. I'm sorry, but let's deal in facts and reality, and not outdated, racist garbage spouted by people who don't know the rules.

@Curmudgeon, Maybe we can show them films of Mel Blount pile driving a WR in to the ground or Joe Greene grabbing face mask and elbowing in the face.
Or maybe the Raiders Jack Tatium close lining WRs and paralyzing another player or Turkey Jones pile driving Bradshaw.

As for today, how about The Ravens Ngata slapping Ben in the face, breaking his nose and Suggs trying to pull Ben's helmet off. Both in the same game last year and both with no flags?

Also, the reason Cleveland put McCoy back in, and why they say now that he "looked OK", is because Harrison hit him mostly with his hands, shoving him, and the helmet to helmet was incidental, as part of the tackle.

Harrison was told he could do that when the QB left the pocket and was running to gain yardage -- as McCoy quite obviously was, until he changed him mind last second and tried to dump it off. Has Harrison played "dirty" at all this season? No.

Anyone picking on him now is, at best, a thug.

One of the funniest aspects of Steeler machismo/paranoia is when guys express the views that:
1. Any effort to protect players brains from damage is sissy-fied.
AND
2. The big, mean commissioner bully is picking on us!

Somehow the Steelers have a moron offensive coordinator, a senile defensive coordinator, and all the league's refs and officials have it in for them, yet they keep going to the playoffs and Super Bowls.

What would these folks be saying if they were Browns fans?

*t is beyond belief that some think the NFL is "out to get" the Steelers. There is no plausible explanation why they would want to do so.

Did Goodell call Harrison on his cell and tell him to lower his helmet and blast McCoy in the head just so Goodell can fine or suspend Harrison?

It makes about as much sense as thinking the NFL has a vendetta against the Steelers.

(It is rare indeed when I find myself defending an inconsistent NFL because of paraniod Steelers fans.)